Spoiled for choice

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Sgt.Heide
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby Sgt.Heide » Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:31 pm

HeadShot wrote:The wheels on the bus go round and round, round and round, round and round....


My thoughts exactly. We've travelled back in time 7 years as well.
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby slick63 » Wed Jun 12, 2013 10:15 pm

Chomley-Warner wrote:
slick63 wrote:I remember the Cornwall game well, run by some of the lads who went up to Josh`s D Day game at Candleston.

Oh, you were there? Gucie and some of the F&O/Grange Farm lads from up here went too. It was run by the site owners, KGB, some of whom had previously been to our first game up here. Yep, Rob, Victor and Jes were at D-Day too

Yep they`re still going strong albeit on a different site, equally boggy but with some interesting variations in terrain.
- Jes is still gagging for a SW WW2 game and did run a site on the cliffs that had beach access below. Would have an awesome Pont du Hoc game but too far for us CiA to recce and organise a game!

Unfortunately they lost that site. Owners stopped them holding events at the fort due to health and safety reasons I believe. Jez was head marshal at South West Wargames whose main site was the old shire horse centre just outside Plymouth. Would`ve made an outstanding setting for a ww2 game, I discussed it with Jez at the time but it wasn`t pushed.
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby Moss » Wed Jun 12, 2013 10:18 pm

I think we need to advertise this hobby differently, maybe Josh's idea of going and getting peeps to sign up at shopping centers is the way to go? Yes the hobby will take steps back but shit happens I suppose, WW2 is no longer in the spotlight sadly (Although with the 70th D-Day anniversary next year we may get a sudden drive of players). One of the biggest problems is the price of the hobby, which is sadly out of our control. The availability of WW2 guns can be a factor for some. The lack of readily available, cheap and reliable rifles is a bugger. I dunno, I'm just a newbie but these issues seem to be the most prominent to me. Lack of interest and lack of reasonably/cheaply priced guns and kit. I suppose we just have to try and find the solutions.
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby Sgt.Heide » Wed Jun 12, 2013 10:44 pm

There's plenty of cheap WW2 guns available, much more than there were when this all started and, the used market is also very healthy. Also, I don't buy into the idea of the kit being expensive, especially when compared with going for an ultra modern loadout. The games are also generally much cheaper than the modern themed alternatives. Players really never have had it so good in terms of availability, choice and price of WW2 kit and weapons, it's a pity that so many end up just collecting the bloody things, instead of using them.
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby Gadge » Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:59 pm

Its like that in all hobbies though pete to a degree.

I'm really into miniature wargaming and spend a lot of time of various wargames forums.

One of them that i frequent is full of very passionate people who rave or complain about new lead figure releases, critique each other paint jobs, argue about the best rules etc (sound familiar) but when pressed... hardly any of them actually play games. They just buy and hoarde lead soldiers and quite often never even paint em.

On the groups facebook page they had a poll among the real hardcore posters and most of them last played a game over a year ago, only two or three actually play eveyr month or so.

Now thats a bloody boardgame/wargame, that something that they spend *hundreds* of pounds on and you could set up and play in three hours or so and they cant be bothered.

small wonder when our hobby requires you to be out the house for *three days* that people dont bother :)


You're right though it's crap when people have all the gear but dont use it but its not unique to airsoft.
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Moss
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby Moss » Thu Jun 13, 2013 5:15 am

Sgt.Heide wrote:There's plenty of cheap WW2 guns available, much more than there were when this all started and, the used market is also very healthy. Also, I don't buy into the idea of the kit being expensive, especially when compared with going for an ultra modern loadout. The games are also generally much cheaper than the modern themed alternatives. Players really never have had it so good in terms of availability, choice and price of WW2 kit and weapons, it's a pity that so many end up just collecting the bloody things, instead of using them.


I did mean that for someone just starting out airsoft, prices can seem rather daunting. Mind a lot of the people I've asked to join think they have to get it all in one go, despite what I tell them. I must admit I am guilty of the kit hoarding thing, I have a whole original U.S Vietnam kit in my wardrobe along with an M-16. Will I get rid of my 'Nam kit? Nope probably not. I still want to keep it for the eventuality that I do go to a 'Nam game. But WW2 just appeals to me more.

In terms of kit, it is expensive if your not fully into the hobby/have other commitments. This is my only hobby so I like to spend lots of time looking on eBay and all over the interwebs for cheap/bargain kit. But I can see how the price of everything would get a bit much if you had other stuff to do. Maybe the forum would benefit from some budget uniform guides for people who just want to pop in and out of the hobby and not spend too much on kit?

I do appreciate the fact that there was bugger all guns when WW2 airsoft kicked off but the point I was trying to make (on speculation I wasn't that clear about it) is that in terms of readily available cheap and reliable guns, we're lacking in rifles (hopefully this new Tanaka springer gets cloned). I'd also like to add that the used gun market isn't helpful for new/young Airsofters as the VCRA gets in the way there, and is another thing that is out of our control. But in terms of kit the used market is very helpful as buying helmets on eBay seems to just be a "who can bid the most rediculous, way over average amount" competition. I have a friend who turned his nose up at using 2nd hand kit mind :roll: , but for most peeps it's very helpful. Anyway I can see what people mean by "getting hooked by your first game" as the Crete game was ones of the most exciting things I have ever done and I can't wait to get to the next one.

Maybe the hobby is just going through a slow/sleepy period, it could get jump started again by the 70th D-Day anniversary. You never know...
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby Chomley-Warner » Thu Jun 13, 2013 7:53 am

killacommy wrote:Maybe the hobby is just going through a slow/sleepy period, it could get jump started again by the 70th D-Day anniversary. You never know...
Dejan.

Certainly an opportunity not to be missed.
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby MartinR » Thu Jun 13, 2013 8:04 am

the spectacle of 50+ players per side


I rather tend to view Joshs big November games as my big annual 'company per side' outing. Certainly a very different experience to the smaller section/platoon sized ones.

I hope there is another one planned for this year.

Cheers
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby Boshman » Thu Jun 13, 2013 9:19 am

MartinR wrote:
the spectacle of 50+ players per side


I rather tend to view Joshs big November games as my big annual 'company per side' outing. Certainly a very different experience to the smaller section/platoon sized ones.

I hope there is another one planned for this year.

Cheers
Martin


Even at Josh's big games, (the last one was epic btw) the actual engagements do tend to be only section sized anyway as the players nearly always get split down into smaller squads with seperate areas of operation and objectives and are never fighting as a single large unit.

The only game I can personally recall where there was a full Platoon sized engagement was at Sevastopol where we had 30 Germans attacking a single position with 25 Russians.
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby Gadge » Thu Jun 13, 2013 9:35 am

indeed, even the biggest ones we've run we try and task each platoon (usually two per side) with independent objectives to get the ost play out of the site,stop bottlenecks and provide variety as platoon 'a' from the allies can then clash with a variety of axis groups etc rather than just headbutting against a mob of 30 germans all day.

Having restricted radios to one per platoon tends to mean that sections dont wander off too much as they lose effectiveness once they are out of the loop with regards to where people need to be.

The problem with a huge joint organiser game, and its been suggested dozens of times is that both players bases and organiseres all want quite different things.

Those who want 'numbers' dont want to water down the 'detail' but without relaxing certain criteria (allowed units, allowed kits, depth of rules) etc you wont get 'everyone' in. Equally and more dissapointingly there are still a few people with very deep grudges still against others in the scene (for example a guy i knew who no longer plays wouldnt go to any events run by 'person x' or if 'group y' were going so he basically cut himself out of the scene - daft but it happens).

You've then got to come up with a good plan that all the organisers want to do and wil work , agree on a battle that isnt just 'd-day' again that big and involving etc. it's hard enough sometimes to get an agreement on the game you want to run and the site you want to use when you're all good mates, on the same organising body and have the same ethos at times ( with PBI we had some massive rows at times about the direction/nature of the game etc) and if you then add in up to 15 or so extra guys who you've all got to come to an accord with it's not easy.

The only 'quick fix' is a mass, lowest common denominator 'NWE 44' game with very simple rules, very lax 'any unit' standards on a huge woodland site that someone can get cheap or for free - but does anyone want that?
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby Moss » Thu Jun 13, 2013 9:58 am

The only 'quick fix' is a mass, lowest common denominator 'NWE 44' game with very simple rules, very lax 'any unit' standards on a huge woodland site that someone can get cheap or for free - but does anyone want that?


If its what's needed to breathe new life into the hobby shouldn't we all just grin and bear it? We need to get more people interested before the game can advance any further.
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby Wladek » Thu Jun 13, 2013 10:08 am

killacommy wrote:
The only 'quick fix' is a mass, lowest common denominator 'NWE 44' game with very simple rules, very lax 'any unit' standards on a huge woodland site that someone can get cheap or for free - but does anyone want that?


If its what's needed to breathe new life into the hobby shouldn't we all just grin and bear it? We need to get more people interested before the game can advance any further.


We already have it. they are fine, I have enjoyed them too.
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby pvtjohnny » Thu Jun 13, 2013 3:10 pm

:rofl: I LOVE WW2 AIRSOFT, ME! The amount of reaction to topics is bewildering at times. But at least it shows people care :ghey:
I think we are all apt to "fall into" certain game types or preferred organisers. I, for one know I have and perhaps I need to widen my horizons a bit. When I posted up about a joint game it was more about sharing the work load/risk as much about game size. And I agree with Martin, I too see Josh's epic end of year battle weekend as my big bash (an excellent they are too)!
I've only EVER attended one game which I thought was terrible, the rest have given me some fantastic memories and experiences. The tension of smaller CIA games, the balls out epics that are Gunman games to the AGS games which gave me one of the most visually impressive sights I think I'll ever see (I was one of the 25 Russians facing the 30 man attack through plumes of smoke......awesome). Lets chill, get some perspective and acknowledge we have a really great hobby with lots of variation. Perhaps we as "customers" need to take stock of our own reservations and support, in numbers the games we have.
We might even consider that any newbe reading these forums may be put off from all the complaining, moaning and desire to change everything (yes, I know I've been as guilty as anyone) :slap:
I'm making a resolution to get to as many games as I can, use as much kit as possible and to dump some of my preconceptions about organisers. AMEN! :good:
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby Moss » Thu Jun 13, 2013 3:20 pm

There should be a "like" button! :good:
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Re: Spoiled for choice

Postby prideofengland » Thu Jun 13, 2013 5:28 pm

Like :spam: (well ok its spam but looks a bit like a button :slap:)
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