Thanks to all

A Gunman Airsoft 'D-Day' series battle weekend
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pvtjohnny
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Re: Thanks to all

Postby pvtjohnny » Sun Nov 18, 2012 10:44 pm

Well, truly fantastic weekend! Big shout out to Josh and his crew for organising everything.
Great to see everyone and to hook up with Dog Co once again whose hospitality seems endless. Getting to ride about in the T25 armoured car was awesome and Doug deserves huge recognition for building the bb magnet! All the vehicles take the game experience to that higher level. Game play was excellent all weekend, with some fantastic firefights. Was rather entertaining being pinned behind the caravan with fire coming in from left, right, above and below meaning I had to sit up on the tow bar to avoid being shot! Plenty of near death scrapes during saturday and I will be reporting Ian of the Daganham Nazis to the war crimes commission for t-bagging a downed soldier!!! Found today great. Loads of action with excellent co-ordinted pressure from the Airbourne squads resulting in some quite comprehensive victories. So, to sum it up, the mix of heavy fighting, patrolling and the excellent site all made for a great experience.
I would like to see some clear rules for use of armoured vehicles. As I know there were a few questions raised about the gunner being visible to fire, fair point however, the fact that the vehicle wasn't 'respected' very often as groups or even 2 man teams of lightly armed enemy would engage it without issue or 'fear' meant any one did try to stand died immediately. Which makes the car all but useless for fighting. Perhaps any position attacked by the car could be able to lay only enough fire down on the car to allow them to run away! Josh did put this idea forward at the start however, most enemy just took the car as a big target to shoot at even without a at weapon. Just my thoughts...! Any how, top, top weekend!
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prideofengland
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Re: Thanks to all

Postby prideofengland » Mon Nov 19, 2012 1:19 am

Crowley wrote:Wow great weekend, thanks to all, big thanks to Josh, Nigel and Gage for running a superb event.

Link to some pictures taken before getting stuck in on Saturday, sadly my camera battery died early on sunday :( shame cos the light was lovely...

https://plus.google.com/photos/10992586 ... 3pOCvo_JHA

Andy.


Yes great photo's and great to see so many FJ at an event, the vehicles looked superb :good:
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Re: Thanks to all

Postby MartinR » Mon Nov 19, 2012 9:24 am

A great weekend, thank you very much to Josh for organising it and Nigel & Gadge for commanding both sides so well. Particular thanks to Baker company for tolerating my efforts at command in good humour, I only got all of you killed a couple of times :) As we stumbled around the wood trying to work out where the hell we were, sayings about 'lieutenants' and 'maps' came to mind...

As is now traditonal, I managed to blow myself up defusing mines, and I'm just sorry that we never go to spring our cunning demo charge booby trap at CP6. Still aching, scratched and as high as kite.

Cheers
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Re: Thanks to all

Postby bear » Mon Nov 19, 2012 9:56 am

Well what can I say……my first gunman game was a truly epic experience! Big thanks to josh and his team for running this so well and putting it on, on such an amazing site!
Just like to say thanks to pvt Johnny for introducing me Dog company! Brilliant group of lands!! Mayed me feel really welcome!! I'm looking forward to fighting and drinking with you guys again! And finally a massive thanks to Doug for lending me his BAR for the weekend and also letting me jump in the back of the armoured jeep for most of the Saturday! I'm always gona remember driving down the lane full of Germans at full pelt, to the sound of a hundred BBs bouncing off the armour!!

Carnt wait for the next one

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Re: Thanks to all

Postby Gadge » Mon Nov 19, 2012 10:25 am

Quite honestly one of the best WWII games for a long time for me. Also probably the biggest. It was a real treat to have 'platoons' that were actually the size of real wwii platoons that had been in the field for a while (around 20 men per zug in some). It meant Evo and I could task you realistically.

Great scenario and rules from Josh, great site found by the Dog Co guys... hats off there. Couldnt have happened without James putting in the contacts to get us such a unique and unspoilt location.

I'm still shattered but i'll try and summarise my thoughts.

Germans, you were a pleasure to be in 'command' of, you were tasked with a job, went off and did it or died trying, no arguing , minimal messing about and only one or two persistent 'lone wolves' :) Special thanks to the zug commanders on various days (Ade, Martin, Justin, Rich and Dave) and a little extra thanks to Chomley for being a very capable commander of the mech zug, you were run around ragged plugging up any gaps in the line and did excellently - you were missed on Sunday!

Saturday was amazing with our initial line being broken through (note to troops, its ok to go get food in the field but let us know...) we pulled back to a stronger defensive line and 'slammed the door' to pivot on our right flank and swing the left round in an arc... its a text book company manouvre but a bloody difficult one to do perfectly with trained soldiers... you guys managed it excellently and i was very very proud of the side for the seamless manouvre.

Sunday was less refined as the drop in numbers really showed. with Ten men to a zug and only three of them (zug 3 were down to seven men) we had no chance at all of holding out when hit at a postion in the line by 30 or more allies... still you fought well and put enough pressure on to make the allies forget their *goals* and fixate on kills.

He held the line, we stopped the armour breaking through intact and left the field with honour, well done lads.

Allies... you were great moving targets, sorry opponents :) In all honestly you played excelently, I had next to no complaints from my guys about the enemy (usually you get a fair few as the weekend wears on) and the standard of kit was excellent in the few instances i did see you out there, really creating the illusion of WWII being recreated.

Some great pics so far!


Highs:
Massive forces to manouvre.. no pretending four guys are a 'company'
Reliable commanders who threw themselves into it
amazing site
great opponents
Hoppy and ross's hospitality friday night
Food and company in the pub on sat

Lows:
Some players not bothering to read the rules, there are a *lot* but if you just want to wear cool kit and get kills, why not go to an open day instead?
Freezing temp sat night, woke up with ice on the tent!
One or two players who simply 'dont get WWII' , regretabbly the same one or two people who come, dont enjoy it then come back to play badly again
(and i really am talking about *one* or two out of the 100 players or more there)
Lack of light at this time of the year meaning that you have to really condense the activity to get good adventures in

All in all though, top stuff. Probably the biggest and best WWII event so far.
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Re: Thanks to all

Postby ww2stu » Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:21 pm

First of all thankyou Josh and all your crew for putting on a great event. :good:

Easily one of the best events I have been too so far. The size of the enagements was massive with easily on a few occasions 20 people opening up on a similiar amount of guys at the same time. One of the high points on the first day was with the GMC truck and the armoured car pushing at the bottom of the road which joined the field. Even though the allies were pushed back I went through every single BAR mag trying to supress german reinforcements and then the inevitable counter attack. Hitting many of the "krauts" before they reached there dugouts.

Was great to see and catch up with so many people. Except Marsh who finally got her revenge on me. Beating me to death with an MP40 as I was screaming for a medic. (i will get you back!)

The site was amazing, I just hope everyone cleared up after themselves and we are welcomed back!

High Points:
Massive engagements.
Veichles (on both sides) were amazing to see in the field.
Level of effort that everyone had made on Kit was excellent.
Squad play and the command structure

Low Points:
On multiple times (especially on the last day) there seemed to be alot of lone wolfing going around on the german side.

Obviously a new site and Josh had stated that he wasn't going to be in the field a great deal, but both days didnt kick off quickly. And as a result on Sunday we didnt even manage to get 3 hours out on the field. The germans were briefed before moving out (why not brief them when they were there?) and the yanks and brits were briefed after our deployment. We could of easily been briefed when the germans started to move out and walked into our starting postion, probably getting another 30 minutes of game time. I did actually suggest this from an allied prespective. But a few people had decided to wonder back off to tents and the allied commander didnt want to brief without everyone being threre. Please take this as constructive critism though, as it in no way spoiled my weekend. Just would of been nicer to get some more time in the field :good:

Stu
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Re: Thanks to all

Postby dieselmonkey » Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:39 pm

ww2stu wrote:The germans were briefed before moving out (why not brief them when they were there?) and the yanks and brits were briefed after our deployment. We could of easily been briefed when the germans started to move out and walked into our starting postion, probably getting another 30 minutes of game time.


I appreciate what you mean, but just to address this, it was purely due to the Germans being sent to three separate locations, rather than sending them to the Axis HQ on the far side of the site, then briefing them and having them walk back to their positions from there, which would have taken just as long! :D

There's always a problem with trying to get games to start on time, if you say 'briefing at 9am', a lot of people think that means 'at 9:30 i'll start putting my webbing on', but as it's a legal requirement for people to hear the safety brief, so you have to wait until everyone's there, or you have to repeat a 15 minute brief ten times as people turn up in small groups, which isn't ideal, either.

Any late sunday starts are generally down to hangovers, and there's very little we can do about that, as the social side is at least as important as the shooting side for most people, but I appreciate it can be frustrating, especially in winter when gaming time is severely limited by daylight hours.
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Re: Thanks to all

Postby ww2stu » Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:56 pm

dieselmonkey wrote:
ww2stu wrote:The germans were briefed before moving out (why not brief them when they were there?) and the yanks and brits were briefed after our deployment. We could of easily been briefed when the germans started to move out and walked into our starting postion, probably getting another 30 minutes of game time.


I appreciate what you mean, but just to address this, it was purely due to the Germans being sent to three separate locations, rather than sending them to the Axis HQ on the far side of the site, then briefing them and having them walk back to their positions from there, which would have taken just as long! :D

There's always a problem with trying to get games to start on time, if you say 'briefing at 9am', a lot of people think that means 'at 9:30 i'll start putting my webbing on', but as it's a legal requirement for people to hear the safety brief, so you have to wait until everyone's there, or you have to repeat a 15 minute brief ten times as people turn up in small groups, which isn't ideal, either.

Any late sunday starts are generally down to hangovers, and there's very little we can do about that, as the social side is at least as important as the shooting side for most people, but I appreciate it can be frustrating, especially in winter when gaming time is severely limited by daylight hours.


Like I said it didn't impact on the weekend just wish we could have spent a little more time in the field. :) I also didn't realise about the germans on the second day so thanks for pointing that out. :good: This was the first event i wasn't hungover at (as i drove home which was only 10 minutes away) but I have always managed to get all my kit sorted for the morning brief on time. Just my minor frustation from the weekend.
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Re: Thanks to all

Postby dieselmonkey » Mon Nov 19, 2012 1:13 pm

ww2stu wrote:
dieselmonkey wrote:
ww2stu wrote:The germans were briefed before moving out (why not brief them when they were there?) and the yanks and brits were briefed after our deployment. We could of easily been briefed when the germans started to move out and walked into our starting postion, probably getting another 30 minutes of game time.


I appreciate what you mean, but just to address this, it was purely due to the Germans being sent to three separate locations, rather than sending them to the Axis HQ on the far side of the site, then briefing them and having them walk back to their positions from there, which would have taken just as long! :D

There's always a problem with trying to get games to start on time, if you say 'briefing at 9am', a lot of people think that means 'at 9:30 i'll start putting my webbing on', but as it's a legal requirement for people to hear the safety brief, so you have to wait until everyone's there, or you have to repeat a 15 minute brief ten times as people turn up in small groups, which isn't ideal, either.

Any late sunday starts are generally down to hangovers, and there's very little we can do about that, as the social side is at least as important as the shooting side for most people, but I appreciate it can be frustrating, especially in winter when gaming time is severely limited by daylight hours.


Like I said it didn't impact on the weekend just wish we could have spent a little more time in the field. :) I also didn't realise about the germans on the second day so thanks for pointing that out. :good: This was the first event i wasn't hungover at (as i drove home which was only 10 minutes away) but I have always managed to get all my kit sorted for the morning brief on time. Just my minor frustation from the weekend.


Believe me, it's ours too! :lol: Glad it didn't spoil your weekend though! :D
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Re: Thanks to all

Postby Gadge » Mon Nov 19, 2012 1:21 pm

We've discussed the 'game time' issue a lot among the orgs team over the weekend.

The usual problems are

1. long but neccesary safety brief and rule, followed by needing to 'battle brief' the actual side privately. The more 'immerisive' the event is the more time this is going to take.

2. Few daylight hours. Not only does this mean we couldnt realistically play past 4pm much on the sat it also means its harder to get people to get up on a sat or sun morning if its still dark outside. If you're in a tent you tend to wake up with the sun. heavy drinking at socials compounds this.

3. the 'it doesnt apply to me' factor. I spent about an *hour* walking around the line of cars/tents telling every one when the safety bried was due to start, when josh was waiting to start it with about 50 per cent of people there i was still going up to groups of people sorting their kit out rather than listening to the brief and *then* sorting their kit out. Even as josh started some people were still fecking about as their kit was more important than listneing to the brief.

As i said several times on the weekend. There is no point repeating the brief three or four times, you need everyone together and the people who do dawdle about make everyone else lose game time.

A further problem was the vast size of the forces, the booking arrangements dont always work out in real life so you need to franctically re-org sections to make them equal sized. Add in that even at this late point some people were still arriving.

So how to tackle it.

We had a few ideas.

1. sign in on friday night, you at sign in also sign that you have read the game rules. This means at the brief we just have to cover the basics.
2. Asking people to ease off partying too hard, it wasnt that bad this weekend tbh, but at some events people are drinking til 5am the night before and in no state to play on the morning after.
3. Putting in a rule that if you're not there at the briefing and ready to deploy by 'x oclock' then you wait an hour and get inserted by truck an hour later with any other stragglers... it's not ideal but if people cant be punctual it means that 35 guys are not waiting 30 minutes for 2 people messing about with their webbing or still having breakfast :)

In ten years of running these events i've seen less than a handful ever start on time, finish on time or not go completley off page with regards o the battle plan.

Believe it or not this was one of the events that more or less kept to the programme :)
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Re: Thanks to all

Postby Chomley-Warner » Mon Nov 19, 2012 1:23 pm

Had an excellent day on Saturday. Loved the continuous and fluid gameplay throughout the day - very hard to work out what was going on where and plenty of confusion and shifting plans and thinking on the fly (far from a criticism, I love it!) plus a brand new site to get to grips with (and really easy to get to as well :good: ).

Brilliant fun driving troops around in the GAZ (sheesh, who needs brakes?) and trying to comply with HQ directives with constantly changing situation in the battle. Glad we eventually got some heavier weaponry and got a panzerfaust team out there, but a shame supplies of mortar shells didn't get through the lines when they would have been most useful!

Just one big criticism and two minor whinges. Biggy: it is really bad form and inconsiderate to fellow players to ignore briefing calls and continue rummaging through cars and finding other things more important to do. It is your duty (consider it part of the 'experience') to be ready for action when the orders tell you to be. It really isn't hard to be timely and organised!
Whinge 1: Astonishing to find a gaggle of troops having a picnic around a CP when their comrades are being slaughtered in the field and positions are being over-run. :slap: Ask HQ for permission to break off first, you aren't going to die of hunger! :potnoodle:
Whinge 2: If you are told to disengage and withdraw then do so in haste - exchanging fire with a fellow airsofter just because you can see them and you want to kill them might be to the detriment of many other players. HQ look at the big picture and not individual skirmishes - follow orders even though it may seem daft (and it way well turn out to be daft, but that's war for you :wink: )

I had intended to stop on Sunday but got up at 6am with frost on the inside the tent and after hurriedly dressing realised I'd be standing around in the freezing cold for the next four and a half hours or more waiting for others to get a wriggle on. That frosty dawn would have been awesome to fight in! As it was I helped Keith get packed up and then buggered off myself, was at home up north and in the bath by 9am. :tongue:

Anyhoo, excellent event, cheers to Josh and crew, and the players who got into the WW2 battle experience mindset. :good:
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Re: Thanks to all

Postby Gadge » Mon Nov 19, 2012 2:01 pm

adam_j_b wrote:We had a perfectly good picnic interrupted by two Germans who were unaware they couldn't storm a CP with only two people!!


Sorry about that, again it's people not listening to the brief, having more important things to do when the rules are explained or just not wanting to follow them :(

Hopefully in future the idea of the 'standing orders' that you need a set number of men to do tasks will be a bit more familiar (its only the third event we've triedit) and the ammeded 'sunday rule' that a section leader has to make the change over will help as people will realise there is no point running off on their own if they need their NCO to approve the swap over.

I appreciate the 'standing orders' annoy the hell out of one or two people on both sides who couldnt adjust from a regualr skirmish outlook/attitude but the general response we've had since we first put them into games (cold war actually....) is that most players love it.

Rather than having little shootouts between ones and twos over a water but you end up with *battles* with 20-30 a side over a stategic location etc.

I know it's not everyones thing but I know it works better from an orgs point of view.
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Re: Thanks to all

Postby Simon » Mon Nov 19, 2012 2:51 pm

as stated earlier very enjoyable and well run event.

From reading all the posts and comments everything seems very positive. From a newbie who was attending only his second WW2 event, i would like to thank everyone for making me feel welcome, but also to raise a point with regard to the rules.

Gunman made an excellant suggestion with regard to the field note book, something i will have with me next time. My main concern, and this was a concern i had with me, not others, was my adherence to the rules. having played paintball for the best part of 10 years, then moving to airsoft a few months ago and doing general modern airsoft, it is a very big stepup to WW2 events.

while the rules are not rocket science, it is very difficult to change habits obtained over years of playing simular (yet very different) events, and only time and experience will allow new players to change their habits and mind sets. so i can image how frustrating it must be for "experienced" players to have "newbies" around. So to the point, would it be possible to have a "newbie squad/zug" in a game, with an experienced (and patient) commander overseeing them, this will ensure he/she can then guide and teach them first hand, rather than the new guys and gals trying to follow the others and/or wandering off on their own. This is only a thought and has probably been considered before, but it would give new players the opportunity to learn and not impact negatively on the experienced players game, after all WW2 is more than just dressing up and definately more than just airsoft, being a hobby, rather than a passtime.
I have in no way touched upon the complexities of the doing the above, just athought thrown out there. :whistle:


p.s i would like to point out the "gloating" allied players standing over us in the pictures very kindly asked permission before displaying their victory, very gentlemanly and honourable of them.
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Re: Thanks to all

Postby Gadge » Mon Nov 19, 2012 3:00 pm

Its an idea, certainly

However i can see it being a real nightmare for the guy in charge (who equally cant play with his mates but has to look after new players). Equally you dont have that experience to call upon.

You have to remember that the zug leaders and the side commanders are players too. Evo working on the radio doesnt get paid for sitting in a jeep moving zugs about by map and radio, thats our game though. We play a sort of 'wargame' with real people on the map against Nige or Josh :)

Usually, in the real world, you'd only have a section of new recruits with a cadre of one or two veterans in dire situations. It's usually better to filter new guys into existing formations... they can lead by example. I see this translating well into airsoft.

Leading a section of new guys who all had 'open day' mindsets on would be like hearding cats but putting the new players into a section of players who know what is going on means the new guys just have to follow, watch and learn.

Just my opinon, not the official Gunman line btw!
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Re: Thanks to all

Postby cjw957 » Mon Nov 19, 2012 3:08 pm

Have to say i loved the rule of needing 2 or more to advance made things really good , we had to withdraw from a scrap a couple of times due to it , including trying to dislodge the Germans on the ridge early on , we tried to take it with just our squad in 2 sections trying to attack both flanks but a few good kills by the defending Germans stopped our advance and we had to withdraw regroup get a squad of brits and take it with numbers :)

we were only there for the Saturday but we never heard any moans whats so ever , and i know every one in our squad had a cracking day :)
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