Pioneer Loadout

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scubasteve89
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Pioneer Loadout

Postby scubasteve89 » Wed May 21, 2014 7:48 am

Greetings,

Looking for a little insight on how to adapt between a regular Heer Infantryman and a Pioneer? I love the basic infantry impression but I'm a bit of a gear whore (in the sense that I like owning lots of gear).

So what I need to know is how much of a difference there is in the uniform side of things? Different side boards?

What I would love to own is:
Pioneer Axe and Pouch/Sheath
Wire Cutters and Pouch

But I have no idea where to obtain them, so help is most welcome.

I was also considering a set of these as well:

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They look pretty decent for $100 (Got a £40 voucher too :D )


Any help and advice is most welcome!
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Conrad Uno
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Re: Pioneer Loadout

Postby Conrad Uno » Wed May 21, 2014 9:11 am

have a look at this for sale thread -
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BootedFeet
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Re: Pioneer Loadout

Postby BootedFeet » Wed May 21, 2014 9:15 am

Only difference in uniform itself is shoulderboards with black waffenfabre instead of the usual white for infantry.
As for tools no one soldier was even encumbered with half a dozen pieces of extra kit. Tools and demolition equipment was always spread out between the squad, for example one pioner might be carrying wire cutters and a grenade bag, another with an Axe and a shovel, another with the demolition gear and so on.

A bunch of us clubbed together at Foy and formed a pioneer squad, there's a few pics on the Foy thread in the archive, might help give an idea :good:
I've fired a bullet on every continent. Nearly hit someone, too.

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scubasteve89
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Re: Pioneer Loadout

Postby scubasteve89 » Wed May 21, 2014 11:21 am

Sounds interesting actually.

Would love to get my hands on a Pioneer Axe!

Any reproduction sites for those?
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MartinR
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Re: Pioneer Loadout

Postby MartinR » Wed May 21, 2014 12:05 pm

You could just buy the pouch and stuff a couple of steel poles in it. British wire cutters are relatively easy to come by but are a different design to the German ones.

As above, the only uniform difference is black waffenfarbe, so if you have generic collar litzen, you just need shoulder boards piped black.

The engineer pouches/pack do scream 'engineer' though, and are relatively inexpensive. The pack needs to be stuffed with things to keep its shape, empty boxes will do, rather than 3kg demo charges.... you are meant to put your zelt and canteen in it too.

Cheers
Martin
"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" Helmuth von Moltke
Toys: AGM MP40, Cyma M1A1, TM M14/G43/SVT40, TM VSR/K98, SnS No. 4, ASG Sten, Ppsh.

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Boshman
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Re: Pioneer Loadout

Postby Boshman » Wed May 21, 2014 12:57 pm

scubasteve89 wrote:Sounds interesting actually.

Would love to get my hands on a Pioneer Axe!

Any reproduction sites for those?


The small Axe / Hammer are the same as the bundeswehr ones, just need to repaint the head black. readily available cheap on ebay, for example:


Carriers are available for Schusters.ru. They are different from the one I have but look pretty good.
“I wanted to come to the Volga at a specific location at a specific city. By chance it carries the name of Stalin himself. So don’t think I marched there for this reason – it could carry another name – but because there is a very important goal... this goal I wanted to take – and you know – we are very modest, we have it already."
Adolf Hitler, November 1942

"Comrades, Red Army men, commanders and political workers, men and women guerrillas! It is on your perseverance, staunchness, fighting skill and readiness to discharge your duty to the country that the defeat of the German-fascist army and the liberation of the Soviet land from the Hitlerite invaders depend! We can and must clear the Soviet land of Hitlerite vermin."
Joseph Stalin, November 1942

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cjw957
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Re: Pioneer Loadout

Postby cjw957 » Wed May 21, 2014 1:04 pm

scubasteve89 wrote:Greetings,

Looking for a little insight on how to adapt between a regular Heer Infantryman and a Pioneer? I love the basic infantry impression but I'm a bit of a gear whore (in the sense that I like owning lots of gear).

So what I need to know is how much of a difference there is in the uniform side of things? Different side boards?

What I would love to own is:
Pioneer Axe and Pouch/Sheath
Wire Cutters and Pouch

But I have no idea where to obtain them, so help is most welcome.

I was also considering a set of these as well:

Image

They look pretty decent for $100 (Got a £40 voucher too :D )


Any help and advice is most welcome!


if the packs are from international-military-antiques http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/290598565828 , i had from there good service and they seem very good , used them for a ww2 and nam game :) , they tend to sell them cheaper on ebay than there shop and think they charged me 25 bucks to post :)
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scubasteve89
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Re: Pioneer Loadout

Postby scubasteve89 » Wed May 21, 2014 1:41 pm

Some great info there guys! Really appreciate it :)


Out of interest... are these usable? They look similar I think?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bundeswehr-Bo ... 5affad339b
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Boshman
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Re: Pioneer Loadout

Postby Boshman » Wed May 21, 2014 4:46 pm

scubasteve89 wrote:Some great info there guys! Really appreciate it :)


Out of interest... are these usable? They look similar I think?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bundeswehr-Bo ... 5affad339b


They are identical except for the grips on the WW2 models and early BW are brown bakelite. Cant quite tell from the pic if those have bakelite grips or not :? there looks to be a mould seam so prob not but they can be found without much trouble. The carriers, especially the full leather pouch are hard to find and pricey. I have one which I got years ago, It seems to good condition to be original but I have never seen any one selling repro's so I'm not sure if is original or not. If it is repro it's absolutle spot on identical to the originals I have seen.

some lovely original pioner stuff for sale here: but not cheap!
“I wanted to come to the Volga at a specific location at a specific city. By chance it carries the name of Stalin himself. So don’t think I marched there for this reason – it could carry another name – but because there is a very important goal... this goal I wanted to take – and you know – we are very modest, we have it already."
Adolf Hitler, November 1942

"Comrades, Red Army men, commanders and political workers, men and women guerrillas! It is on your perseverance, staunchness, fighting skill and readiness to discharge your duty to the country that the defeat of the German-fascist army and the liberation of the Soviet land from the Hitlerite invaders depend! We can and must clear the Soviet land of Hitlerite vermin."
Joseph Stalin, November 1942

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Conrad Uno
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Re: Pioneer Loadout

Postby Conrad Uno » Wed May 21, 2014 9:15 pm

scubasteve89 wrote:Some great info there guys! Really appreciate it :)


Out of interest... are these usable? They look similar I think?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bundeswehr-Bo ... 5affad339b


They're the same as the ones I got from Zib. The handles have hard rubber sleeves... as I said earlier I've got a full leather repro pouch from Continental Militaria for sale, although this type of cutter won't fit... :(
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Steiner
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Re: Pioneer Loadout

Postby Steiner » Thu May 22, 2014 7:35 am

FYI, only about 1 in 5 Pioniers had the full back and side pack kit.
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MartinR
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Re: Pioneer Loadout

Postby MartinR » Thu May 22, 2014 7:42 am

Yes. If you watch the old propaganda film 'Pioniers to the Front!' they are mostly quite lightly dressed, particularly when splashing around in rivers. The main pioniere qualification seems to being a 6' tall blonde giant with perfect teeth :)

Cheers
Martin
"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" Helmuth von Moltke
Toys: AGM MP40, Cyma M1A1, TM M14/G43/SVT40, TM VSR/K98, SnS No. 4, ASG Sten, Ppsh.

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scubasteve89
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Re: Pioneer Loadout

Postby scubasteve89 » Thu May 22, 2014 8:53 am

Well I'm 6ft 3, not blonde and my teeth are ok. 1.5/3, not bad? :happyswing:
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Boshman
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Re: Pioneer Loadout

Postby Boshman » Thu May 22, 2014 11:52 am

Conrad Uno wrote:
scubasteve89 wrote:Some great info there guys! Really appreciate it :)


Out of interest... are these usable? They look similar I think?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bundeswehr-Bo ... 5affad339b


They're the same as the ones I got from Zib. The handles have hard rubber sleeves... as I said earlier I've got a full leather repro pouch from Continental Militaria for sale, although this type of cutter won't fit... :(


They should do! I have the short wirecutters with bakelite grips (they are still pretty big) and case. The case shown on Continental Militaria's web site is the correct one for these so they should fit unless their repro is not sized correctly!

This is exactly what i have:

Drahtschere kurzes Modell Wehrmacht:
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Drahtscherentasche frühe Wehrmacht:
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“I wanted to come to the Volga at a specific location at a specific city. By chance it carries the name of Stalin himself. So don’t think I marched there for this reason – it could carry another name – but because there is a very important goal... this goal I wanted to take – and you know – we are very modest, we have it already."
Adolf Hitler, November 1942

"Comrades, Red Army men, commanders and political workers, men and women guerrillas! It is on your perseverance, staunchness, fighting skill and readiness to discharge your duty to the country that the defeat of the German-fascist army and the liberation of the Soviet land from the Hitlerite invaders depend! We can and must clear the Soviet land of Hitlerite vermin."
Joseph Stalin, November 1942

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Boshman
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Re: Pioneer Loadout

Postby Boshman » Thu May 22, 2014 11:58 am

Bakelite handled cutters are available on german ebay:


Looking at the pic's it does seem that on the later BW ones the handles dont close together as much which might be why they dont fit the pouch! :?
“I wanted to come to the Volga at a specific location at a specific city. By chance it carries the name of Stalin himself. So don’t think I marched there for this reason – it could carry another name – but because there is a very important goal... this goal I wanted to take – and you know – we are very modest, we have it already."
Adolf Hitler, November 1942

"Comrades, Red Army men, commanders and political workers, men and women guerrillas! It is on your perseverance, staunchness, fighting skill and readiness to discharge your duty to the country that the defeat of the German-fascist army and the liberation of the Soviet land from the Hitlerite invaders depend! We can and must clear the Soviet land of Hitlerite vermin."
Joseph Stalin, November 1942

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