We did it!

Heh, a bit off-ish, you threatened to knock fellow organiser's lights out (which didn't go down well). Nay matter, good job we realised you were stressed out!

I think the thing to remember is that this is just a game and we are organising this for punter's benefit, who despite best intentions, aren't as fit and motivated as squaddies. Paramount must be giving them what they want. The CiA style is to challenge players and push them further than other WW2 airsoft organisers would and that is fair enough but I'd question the decision to abandon seven other players to do the best they can on Sunday. Luckily Martin came up trumps, had it been Lardy, Steiner, Webby or the others they would have walked I'm sure.

I think my second point would be that just because things aren't going your way, or the way you expected, doesn't mean the event is failing. Again, its the players that matter - as long as they don't feel they are just cannon fodder and can look back on achievements then all is good - especially for a fluid game such as this where we are just thinking on our feet and fighting, not ticking timings off on a script. Just like at Boryzyn, there is no point stomping about complaining about stuff going off script - the punters were having a fantastic time regardless!

A three man exploratory patrol of Germans got very lucky to bump into all the Jeds together (there is a good reason why Jeds worked in teams of three!) - completely accidental, we had no idea where you would be or when. This wasn't a bad thing, just a turn in events. All came good on Sunday when all but eight Germans (including one invalid) were left in camp since everyone else had left chasing after the diversion. Seven Jeds piled in from uphill killing five of the eight Germans leaving only three men to shoot at the SAS who swept in on borrowed transport (a bit daft as players were specifically told that allies couldn't use transport, but meh). It has top be acknowledged that this sort of event has the potential to go horribly wrong. That's why Josh, who has a living to make, has a much more formulaic approach with marshals all over the place and therefore takes a safe approach that he knows will work. Unless you are Gadge or Dog Co or a noob you won't think its a fantastic event, but you probably wouldn't say it was complete rubbish either.

Now, as it happens I think this was a 100% successful event - if I never play another airsoft game I would be quite happy to look back on Jedburgh as the best WW2 airsoft event ever. It was right up my street and ticked all the boxes from beginning to end. To that end we can ALL pat ourselves on the back for a job well done.

PS I think we had better make clear that Devil's Hill is a different kettle of fish and that players will need to stock up with ammo as there will be trigger time a-plenty for this event!

All valid points David and, again, I apologise unreservedly for my comments on saturday night. I got a bit too emotionally involved with Jedburgh, after writing and rewriting the plan and my perceived "responsibility" for the success or failure of the whole thing was really weighing heavy on me. I had tried to write the game that I'd be excited about playing in and perhaps, I got too wrapped up in that.

We all bear responsibility for success and failure - all of us should be asking of ourselves 'have I done more than enough to make this event a success' not finger pointing or finding fault. This is a learning process, we make mistakes, we make decisions that with the benefit of hindsight could have been made better. This isn't PBI, it isn't an autocracy and it isn't run by prima donnas or for self-glorification. We do this because we want something others don't provide in the expectation others might want the same thing. Turns out they do!

Everyone enjoyed the game (once the pain subsided) and met or exceeded their expectations - and that is a result in my book. And if they didn't then the fault lay entirely with themselves, not us. (Pffff, Jays' SBG mate )

Did I enjoy the event? - Yes!
Did I enjoy the whole "knock his block off" thing on Saturday night - No. In fact, I sat there thinking, "he can punch me if he wants, but i'll burn his fucking car afterwards" , still these things get said in the heat of the moment!

For me, this has been an incredibly immersive event. Very, very happy that the Germans (bar the moaning SBG bastard - who was, it must be said, very unlucky when it came to getting into he thick of things - he seemed to miss EVERY engagement by about 5 minutes) Even more impressed that the campsite area was policed up nicely on the litter front.

As to the Allied raid on the German camp, I specifically sent one of the sections out for two reasons 1: I wanted Josh caught 2: to reduce the number in the German camp to a level where the Allies could attack it with a decent chance of success. I like people to finish on a high, and after the shit that the Jed's dropped themselves into on Saturday, they deserved a real morale booster. Put it this way, It's the last half hour of an event that really sticks in people's minds. Andy wont be thinking "I was proper fucked", he'll be thinking "Yay, we got into the German camp!"

Do I like "set ups". Nope. I'm a competetive little shit, but it's whats needed by the punters that matters!

I really thought that you'd get Josh, Jay. As far as I knew on sunday, he and his 2 mates were sacking it and staying at his van. I was very surprised to be told that he and the welsh bloke had decided to have a pop at the DF on their own.

I also gave Josh the hardest, most prone to capture task on saturday but, he did everything I asked and played the part pretty well! You can't say I didn't try!

You are quite right Pete - only Josh and his american mate up there, no one else apart from one bloke packing up. Everyone else in the allies were either in place to the north and east of our HQ or making their way there. Guy and I popped up there to have a chat with him to make sure all was OK. He was full of enthusiasm and refused a lift to help him get to his diversionary point even though he knew he couldn't hit the planned timing, kudos to him. He made a hullabaloo and troops were sent up there to investigate - he avoided contact and snuck down further and blew the DF!

I was actually quietly and, somewhat grudgingly, shocked by Josh. I had expected him to be a total dick. But, once he dropped the stupid Polish accent, he played a blinder! He did everything I asked of him, without question. We should also remember that, without him, we would have had no mortar or barby. He was also game enough to hump 2 full 5 gallon jerrycans of water from our cars to the SAS base in one trip and, dig holes in concrete like roads to plant mines and he dropped the bulk of the Jed's at their start point. Basically, I couldn't fault the bloke.

I'd question the decision to abandon seven other players to do the best they can on Sunday. Luckily Martin came up trumps, had it been Lardy, Steiner, Webby or the others they would have walked I'm sure.

There was no decision involved in this. Stu and I fully expected them to be following us, but they didn't. I made every effort to contact them through the radio and had no answers. We waited for them to catch up, but they didn't.

We even arranged an RV on the Sunday which they didn't stick to.

But it doesn't matter because they had a good time.

We even arranged an RV on the Sunday which they didn't stick to.

Yes, I almost forgot that! Steve and I eventually got to bed at around 0100hrs on sunday, after speaking to the Jed's and making arrangements. After our vehicle ambush, the SAS could easily have doubled back and completely avoided detection by approaching the German camp from the north as planned but, because we had a prearranged RV to make, we pushed on with haste, hence, we got bumped. We covered 2km pretty quickly to make that RV but, the Jed's had already gone. While the troops rummaged Jed' bergens for water, Steve and I hastily formulated yet another plan and then, we moved out.

To be honest, it was an absolute fucking nightmare leading them. Not something I think I'd be keen to repeat.

They had long faces most of the Saturday, were unhappy about moving across the rough countryside, complained about the flies (one of them was almost freaking out because he was afraid of them). We had to stop every few hundred yards when carrying bergens. They complained the radios were too heavy. Whenever we stopped I repeatedly had to tell them to post lookouts and rear guards. When we stopped they removed their bergens every time, meaning a two minute break turned into a ten minute sit-down. When we were bumped they didn't react or put down any fire, then didn't move according to any orders (apart from to shout back that they could see people to fire at) then they didn't follow the ambush orders I gave which was to push through on our planned route and move on to the SAS base. Instead, they returned to the ERV which was for the first section of the game, that I'd told them we'd now ignore as we were headed to the SAS camp so that was our new ERV.

To be honest, I'm not sure what else I could have done. They weren't following the instructions I gave them and didn't react to orders either. They then said I fucking abandoned them when I spent a good few minutes putting down smoke and a base of fire for them to move up to me under, then repeatedly put out radio calls for them.

I had a good weekend personally, but feel like leading the Jeds was a complete failure and feel responsible for that, even though I did everything to try and help them through it all as well as going across to their camp at midnight to arrange a morning RV that they decided to ignore.

Next time, someone else can do it, and if anyone wants to pick holes in what I did or how I did it, then, quite frankly they can get fucked.

Possibly we could have done without the bergen thing - it became a bit of an obsession and focus of their attention instead of being incidental - as Stephen says, following orders and critical timing is much more important. Jeds didn't drop with massive, weighty bergens - they were met at prearranged RVs and were looked after. If they weren't met then they improvised. In other words we could have stashed the bergens as an objective to get to (representing resistance assistance) and the chaps would only have to carry weapons, water, radios and light rations.

I thought the flies thing was a bit of a surprise - I was surrounded by flies that got worse the wetter I got but they were no more than a blummin nuisance, they only bumped you, they didn't land and crawl or lay eggs up your nostrils! Yet people were freaked out by them. OK, not 'nice' but hardly a biggy, given everything else they had to cope with! Meh, we are all softies I suppose.

I do think we should have had an organiser with them all the time though, we do have a responsibility for their welfare - gawd knows what they could have got up to on their own overnight and it would have sorted morning problems too. And perhaps given some thought to working Jeds in three separate independent teams with their own things to do instead of a team of nine all doing the same thing and getting stuffed together.

None of these are biggies in themselves, but when combined it can be enough to tip the balance. It is sooo easy to organise games in retrospect!

As it was, none of this blighted the event, indeed much worked out for the best. Germans would have had a very boring weekend otherwise - walk up and down some roads for 12 hours, see no one, go to bed. Wake up and get stuffed by surprise attack. Instead we had happy Germans on Saturday who grafted and got results and were still happy enough to relish being stuffed on Sunday! Allies suffered agonies on Saturday and were rewarded on Sunday. Everyone happy.

Ultimately I think we just expected too much of the players, indeed they expected too much of themselves. Its not difficult to learn from this, we are all (mostly) over-aged, flabby and unfit civvies pretending to be soldiers.

Incidentally, Guy had an idea that merits discussion and that is getting the IED crew to be opfor. They can do the shitty hard graft, moving under duress, tabbing and surprise attacks - they love it, know what they are doing and also have an organiser's head on - and we would only have to worry about half of the equation. Certainly easier organisationally and saves half killing our members!

I do think we should have had an organiser with them all the time though, we do have a responsibility for their welfare - gawd knows what they could have got up to on their own overnight and it would have sorted morning problems too. And perhaps given some thought to working Jeds in three separate independent teams with their own things to do instead of a team of nine all doing the same thing and getting stuffed together.

I discussed this with Pete who thought it'd be a better idea to stick together for the Saturday. It would have been very difficult to stay in communication with the Jed teams and RV timings would have been very difficult to adhere to. We missed the SAS RV because we grossly underestimated the time it would take to move across the terrain, and the radios were useless beyond about 750m.

This is why I say in retrospect things are clearer and there is no 'blaming' or pointing fingers. Players should have had an organiser with them for supervision and motivation - they should have had an organiser leading them to make sure they are in the right place at the right time for the attack. As it happens all worked out perfectly - the diversion and Jed attack went ahead through the efforts of self-motivated players, which is fab.

Incidentally, has anyone thanked Josh for his efforts? If not then I'll do it - I've already thanked Keith and Dave for the vehicles & tentage.

Oooh, edit: I have the keys for the site still which I'll send when Guy gives me an address for Ed, we need to organise payment too!

Yes, and I need to get some cheques signed by you Dave. Totally forgot at the weekend. I'll send the cheque book recorded delivery to your studio.

BTW: My favourite moment of the weekend was when I trampled down and area of bracken so people could take on food and water in cover and said to people that they should go in and get sat down and sort themselves out. About 30 seconds later Andy came back out and I said, "Please go back in as we might be seen", so he says "It's not big enough". I just walked into the area and trampled down a bit more bracken and said "It is now"......

Incidentally, Guy had an idea that merits discussion and that is getting the IED crew to be opfor. They can do the shitty hard graft, moving under duress, tabbing and surprise attacks - they love it, know what they are doing and also have an organiser's head on - and we would only have to worry about half of the equation. Certainly easier organisationally and saves half killing our members!

I recall hearing this being mentioned. Nice idea but, I'm personally against it. Because first off, I don't think they "get" our events, secondly, they're cheating feckers who don't take hits and, they use hot guns as well and laugh about it. I also think Glyn Ceiriog has had it as far as a wide ranging, multi objective event goes. From what I've heard, Ceri Forest has been decimated by logging as well.

Well, agree Glyn Ceiriog has had its day, Ceri Forest would need a recce but they do have a third site as well.

I think the point is what we asked of the Jeds and SAS this weekend was beyond their physical and mental capabilities but well within IED crew's. Couple that with intimate site knowledge and you have an opfor you can rely on, guaranteed to be in the right place at the right time and understand a game from an organiser's POV. Certainly worked at Guy's A2C game where they just got on with it - no problems with hot guns or cheating (although the two of them titted about at Churchills but they didn't really have anything to do!).

I'd be happy to stand corrected over the hot guns. My knowledge is based on hearing them bragging about a 600fps SLR and a 500fps AK47 at Bryansk.

It's a bit of a moot point at the moment anyway, seeing as we have the next event virtually ready to go and, hopefully, with another Russian Front one early in the new year. Also, do we really want to run another SAS/SOE type scenario? I'd say that if and when we do another hardcore type event, we do it with the Germans as the hunted and do it as a "proper" E&E event. I've already discussed the seeds of such a scenario with some of you at the post Jedburgh barby.

There you said it, a proper E&E event - its what IED do.
Yes, they like their hot guns - but our game are our rules, their games are their rules.
I wouldn't propose another Jed/SOE event and haven't - but it doesn't matter what you dress it up as, the principle is the same.

Heh, anyway, I'm letting you four sort out next years games, I'm planning on retiring from game organisation after Devils Hill.