Well for Arnhem i feel it has to be Phoenix urban, the embassy would make an awesome Hartenstein Hotel or similar div HQ.
I've not seen the new LFU site.
Kermit has access to a very cool looking site he was showing me aerial pics of but its a fair way down south (cambridge i think)
I liked the ground at close action personally though but i think you could be right about pyros.
"I think we are in rats' alley - Where the dead men lost their bones."
Just a thought - Arnhem ......we will need a bridge for sure ....might take some thought 
I think there are two ways aorund this.
1) we focus on the approach road to the bridge , it was chuffin massive and the airborne lads only actually held one approach ramp... the bridge itself is represented by a german regen point.
2) We focus the battle around the hartenstein, wolfheze station and 2 staffords race to the bridge to relieve the paras.
Its fairly unrelaistic to expect to get a site with a bridge so perhaps focsuing on Lonsdale force and the defensive perimeter might be a plan.
My 'battles' for arnhem would be
1: Race to the bridge and subsequent ambushes
2: relief forces try to reinforce the bridge.
3: massive german counter attack. Allies on one hit and medic, germans on re-gen
4: Allied perimeter of lonsdale force
5: last 'battle' of the day, 'operation berlin' (of sorts) allied troops armed with pistols or very very litle ammo have to move form one end of the site to the other without capture
However thats quite anglo centric we need some inclusion of the US as they never got within shooting distance of Arnhem, they stopped south of that didnt they.
"I think we are in rats' alley - Where the dead men lost their bones."
LFU2 has a bridge and a river... there's even a building next to the bridge...
It may be that we can fight across the bridge or it may not... we'll have to see as there's not been a game there yet.
Sounds perfect could we 'googleearth' it for arial shots?
"I think we are in rats' alley - Where the dead men lost their bones."
yes...
Go to:
53°24'23.48"N 1°33'47.70"W
It would be a shame to go to an urban site that is full of large warehouses (as they all are) and not use them!
And the point about the US is very pertinant.
However, if there is one thing that we learn't from the last game it's that slavish accuracy doesn't matter hugely, the theme does. We put in the German commandos and the nuts thing because it seemed like a good idea and everyone knew the film (they didn't!) but it would have been no better or worse without them.
In other words, instead of following the film running order use a bit of creativity involving the US - the bridge thing was just the culmination.
going to have to do that one at home, school go bonkers if i download stuf onto my work laptop without asking.
"I think we are in rats' alley - Where the dead men lost their bones."
However, if there is one thing that we learn't from the last game it's that slavish accuracy doesn't matter hugely, the theme does. We put in the German commandos and the nuts thing because it seemed like a good idea and everyone knew the film (they didn't!) but it would have been no better or worse without them.
I like to think it made a difference to those who knew . Slavish no , headnods towards yes. NB The issue of comandos came up on the forum before we mentioned it , even though it was pants as an game idea.
I think it's little details that mark it as different from "urban skirmish- oh yeah it supposed to be Arnhem "
Re bridge , Warre mocked something up with ropes and poles and pallets. Might not be .....a bridge too far ........ 
My point about the bridge is that most the figthing taskes place on the ramp leading up to it (which was massive - the bridge was at least 650 metres...). I dont think any UK troops actually got across said bridge...
I think a lot of he really hard fighting at Arhem happens later in the more built up areas as the airborne fight and wait for 30 corp to relieve.
"I think we are in rats' alley - Where the dead men lost their bones."
With the lfu site in mind I see the bridge area to be the place where the Brits fight off the germans... the US start at the other side of the warehouses and have to work their way through the besieging germans.
In reality they didn't make it through in time... will they this time!?!
I had a few ideas on how it could run.
Brits, medic rules with multiple bandages allowed and picked up from within their CP building. Maybe with limited medical supplies allowed... they may have to send a patrol out to get some more...
US with a single medic rule and designated medics.. They start on the far side of the battlefield and have to fight through the germans.
Germans no medic rule but two regen points on each side of the US advance with instant regen. This should make for endless waves of germans coming in to stop the US advance.
Don't know LFU2 or Phoenix or the battle particularily . But looks like l've found some staffs lads who do . Looks like the scenario planning is your gents if you want it, which is possibly good news coz it means I can dedicate some time to this 24 hour proposal , and help out with other bits .
Did have some thoughts about ammo though, with the limits we've got parachuting in ammo to the Brits coud be on the cards, nice little subplots as both sides race to recover the containers.
Tanks and a bridge keep coming back to them both though . ...
Yes, Guy... I'm happy to take Arnhem as my little baby... Gadge I'm sure can help as needed.. I may want help with props as needed as they're not really my forte... and of course signage! We must have street names etc!
CW... let me make this clear so as to remove any concern... I am going to treat Phoenix and LFU2 equally as far as deciding which is most suitable.. I haven't actually played at either yet! LFU2 is the only one I have any idea of the layout of...
I have borrowed "A Bridge Too Far" off Major and will be watching it over xmas.
Arnhems a big of a strong point for me, i thinki've read every decent book and website there is on the battle as it was my regiments greatest hour.
Only *battalion* let alone regiment to ever get two VCs in one battle in the entire history of the decoration...
Essential reading is 'it never snows in september' so you can get the german viewpoint. Essential viewing is 'theirs is the glory'
I'd be wary of focusing too much on the bridge, althoughit was obviosuly the objective' there was a lot more to the battle once it was obvious they were not going to get to both ends let alone hold it. We can do some great scenarios involving defending the pockets and the landing areas.
Furtermore we have to decide are we doing 'Arnhem' or 'Market garden'
Market garden is more inclusive and gives us more scope to condnes the operation into a day as we did wiht BotB.
If we do market garden then really we need several 'towns' thats represent bridges that need tkaing and holding.
It was a nine day battle, it was clear the bridge was not going to get taken entirley by day three and at all not long after. 
"I think we are in rats' alley - Where the dead men lost their bones."
I think I sort of imagined doing more or less the whole of Market Garden but with the concentration on Arnhem and the rest more abstract...
9 towns is not going to happen after all!
Perhaps even re-use the site for different towns... the problem there being having to change the signage...
Better I think to take a bit of a liberty and merge some of the stuff that happened elsewhere into arnhem itself...
My other fairly random thought about this one is i think were going to have to liberalise uk airborne kit to being dpm smock, brown trousers ands red berets
Or nobodies going to be able to afford to do it on the cheap.
Whats everyones thughts on that?
"I think we are in rats' alley - Where the dead men lost their bones."
NO... NO... NO...
Brit kit can be maroon beret, 37 pat webbing and gators and dutch (ahem I mean belgian) denisons... Warren can do the denisons... We might be able to get a bulk discount. (trousers can be lightweights if need be)
We don't need many British troops for this... The larger force will be the US attackers.
BTW in addition to the people we have already in Brit kit we can also probably count on the Gregory's as they want to do british next. My friend Ed is going to get a denison of his own as he absolutely loved the one he borrowed off Guy. I also will be obtaining one for this.
I may try for one from replicaters in the new year... £60 for use in occasional airsoft skirmishes sounds fine to me.
As for doing brit on the cheap... Well not many other people did the uniforms on the cheap for the last game!
Let me see... Denison £60, Beret £10, Trousers £10, Webbing £10. gaiters £5... not actually that bad...
If we don't get enough in that gear then I'd prefer to mix some yanks in with the brits rather than have any dpm on site at all!
Of course the denison can be taken as optional if suitable battledress is worn!
Maybe even allow denims!
Liking what I read so far - especially opening it out a bit.
Films are always very tightly focussed, often inaccurate, and it may be a mistake to base games on a filmic story rather than the 'real' war. Sixty years on and the second war seems to be defined by war films - once given a catchy name it takes on a life all of it's own.
That said, the films are a useful peg to hang the games on, from a publicity point of view!
BTW, I wasn't critising using 'nuts' or comandos thing at all, small things like that makes a difference - just pointing out that while they played a big part in the film they had little significance in the real battle!
Agreed
Guys, try and watch 'theirs is the glory' if you can (i have a copy i'll loan out)
Its a day by day account of the battle at Arnhem itself re-enacted.. not by actors, but by the soldiers who were there. They went back to film it a year later.
Its got real panthers, real tiger IIs in it, real PIATs firing and its mixed in with APU footage pretty bloody well. Not amamzingly acted becasue they are all soldiers not thespians but its about as real as you'll get.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0171824/
"I think we are in rats' alley - Where the dead men lost their bones."
okay... looked at the price on amazon and I'm going to hold off for now. (spent a lot recently)...
I'll buy after xmas or borrow your copy gadge!