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Sgt.Heide
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I've been doing a little research, trying to find battles or local actions where we can allow both US leg infantry and an airborne element. I've looked at Aachen and, whilst the "Big Red One" were there, there is no mention of airborne forces. I'd be reluctant to add them for expediency and make it a "fantasy" scenario. Aachen also fits the date.

Now, I know we have a lot of players who portray 1st Infantry, as that's what they were at Alsos and will also be at Webbys' game. Do you think it's too much to have another game this year that features 1st Infantry?

I'm looking at other NWE battles to try and diversify the US forces but, apart from Market Garden, Bulge and Hurtgen, there's little choice without a lot more reading!



When I want your opinion - I'll tell you what it is!

 
Posted : 15/02/2010 12:42 pm
HeadShot
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Whilst not exactly leg infantry I posted a bit up on Devil's Hill (Which Dave thought was a good name!) on the other thread. We could incorporate GIR which is good enough for those with infantry kit.

I was just looking at the 82nd's movements too. 508th PIR were quite a good one, and would give the Germans the chance to attack. Found this (last two paragraphs most interesting.:

The 504th was given the objective of seizing the longest bridge in Europe over the Maas River and several other bridges over the Maas-Waal Canal. Because of previous cancellations the men of the 82nd were doubtful that the mission would go especially when told that the planned flight was through the Scheldt Estuary (nicknamed "Flak Alley" by Allied bomber pilots) and that they were reportedly outnumbered by 4,000 of Hitler’s Schutzstaffel (SS) troops and an unknown number of German tanks.

No cancellation was received, however, and on 17 September at 1231 hours, the pathfinders landed on the drop zone, followed thirty minutes later by the rest of the Regiment and C Company, 307th Engineers, to become the first Allied troops to land in Holland as part of Operation Market Garden - the largest airborne operation in history. By 1800 hours, the 504th had accomplished its assigned mission (although the enemy had managed to destroy one of the bridges). In just four hours, the Regiment had jumped, assembled, engaged the enemy, and seized its objectives.

Meanwhile, the 508th was under heavy enemy fire from the German paratroopers of the 3rd Fallschirmjager Division. The enemy continually counter attacked. The fight was intense at times but the 508th held the high ground on a place that earned the nickname "Devil's Hill."

For two days, the 82nd held its ground and conducted aggressive combat and reconnaissance patrols until the Irish Guards made the ground link-up, spearheading the advance of the 30th Corps of the Second British Army. However, the Nijmegen road and rail bridges, which were the last remaining link to British Airborne forces in Arnhem, remained in enemy hands.

And this:

After their success in Normandy, the Regiment returned to its billet at Wollaton Park and prepared for its part in Operation Market Garden, jumping on 17 September 1944. The regiment established and maintained a defensive position over 12,000 yards (11,000 m) in length, with German troops on three sides of their position. They seized a key bridge and prevented its destruction. Other units prevented the demolition of the Waal river Bridge at Nijmegen. The regiment additionally seized, occupied, organized and defended the Berg EN Dalkamp Hill mass, terrain which controlled the Groesbeek-Nijmegen area. They cut Highway K, preventing the movement of enemy reserves, or escape of enemy along this important international route.

Can also incorporate gliders in this:

The next glider assault for the 325th was during Operation Market Garden, the largest airborne operation ever conducted. During this battle, the 325th landed among German positions that had surrounded other elements of the 82nd Airborne Division. This glider attack turned the tide of battle and earned the Regiment the Distinguished Unit Citation.



 
Posted : 15/02/2010 12:58 pm
Sgt.Heide
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:slap: My mistake, for some reason, I thought that was Italy! We can't use the bridge at the site, nor the railway cutting, so, this looks ok. In fact, on the site visit, I mentioned to David about having infantry initially having to assist a cut off airborne group.

The next glider assault for the 325th was during Operation Market Garden, the largest airborne operation ever conducted. During this battle, the 325th landed among German positions that had surrounded other elements of the 82nd Airborne Division. This glider attack turned the tide of battle and earned the Regiment the Distinguished Unit Citation.



When I want your opinion - I'll tell you what it is!

 
Posted : 15/02/2010 1:03 pm
HeadShot
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Why is the cutting out of bounds? It's a great part of the site. H&S?



 
Posted : 15/02/2010 1:16 pm
Sgt.Heide
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Something to do with the ramblers if I recall.



When I want your opinion - I'll tell you what it is!

 
Posted : 15/02/2010 1:22 pm
Chomley-Warner
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The roadway runs along the other edge and is used by walkers (actually, the whole site is open to the public!). I do remember when we played there I was moving down the far bank and was a bit surprised to see bods and dogs walking alongside. :shock:

 
Posted : 15/02/2010 1:23 pm
Sgt.Heide
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Here's the map of the site, from Close Action's website. I've updated the railway cutting boundary.-- attachment is not available --



When I want your opinion - I'll tell you what it is!

 
Posted : 16/02/2010 9:21 pm
Sgt.Heide
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Sorry it's taken so long to put together even the most basic outline for the Yanks! Thoughts?


The commander of the U.S. 82nd Airborne Division was skeptical of the Market Garden plan. In his diary he wrote, "It looks very rough. If I get through this one I will be very lucky."

October 1944.

Operation Market Garden had not gone particularly well for 508th of the 82nd Airborne Division, despite landing within 1000 metres of their drop zones on the initial landings and preventing the destruction of a key bridge. Tasked with clearing, patrolling and defending the area of Dalkamp hill , they find themselves with the enemy on three sides and have fended off numerous determined German attacks, with more expected. If the Germans breakthrough, they could threaten the advance of British reinforcements by placing artillery observers on the high ground and bringing up their armour. To reinforce the beleagured paratroops, 325th GIR are sent in to assist and force the Germans out. Landing amidst the enemy, they quickly find themselves embroiled in part of the battle which became known as "Devils Hill", which would drag on for several days.

Facing the "All Americans" was the legendary Field Marshall Model. Among those under his command are troops in transit or on leave in the Wesel area. These would be known as "Corps 'Feldt", a battle group of Heer and Elite Fallschirmjager, along with assorted Waffen SS troops. Many of these troops are battle hardened veterans, sent to Holland to recuperate, "old men and boys" they most certainly are not. These troops under the command of General Kurt Feldt, from which the Kampfgruppe drew its name, are to recapture Dalkamp from the US 82nd Airborne at all costs. Success could turn the tide of the war by giving the allies a bloody nose they may not recover from.



When I want your opinion - I'll tell you what it is!

 
Posted : 25/02/2010 8:45 pm
Chomley-Warner
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Yes, sounds good.

As an additional bit of synergy could we make the date 6th October 1944 (very close to our game date)? The drops started on 17th Sept but they were there for a while, and they were relieved by a British Brigade on November 10. (Gives Yanks a change to beleaguered and entrenched rather than landing and attacking).

It was the 508th Parachute Infantry Regiment (Red Devils) of the 82nd at Berg EN Dalkamp Hill.
Rather than a mish-mash of Germans could we make this primarily 3rd Fallschirmjager Division and Wehrmacht as they were the principle opponents (and allow SS as purloined 'on leave & in-transit'). It will make the German side more defined and accurate, which players like.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/army/82abn-4bde.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/508th_Infantry_Regiment_%28United_States%29
On the night of 5-6 October 1944, the Regiment was relieved by the 325th Glider Infantry Regiment.

 
Posted : 26/02/2010 9:56 am
Sgt.Heide
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Edited. :good: 505th on Groesbeek heights fits better I think. The Germans attacking from a forest (Reichswald) into a forest (Groesbeek).



When I want your opinion - I'll tell you what it is!

 
Posted : 26/02/2010 10:03 am
Chomley-Warner
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Not very inspiring for the German contingent though! Poorly trained rabble vs leet 82nd Airborne sort of gives this a US dominant scenario. And we lose Devil's Hill and I think the Groesbeek heights thing was done and dusted by late September and I'm not sure 325th GIR were there?

 
Posted : 26/02/2010 10:39 am
Sgt.Heide
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325th reinforced 505th and 508th. I'm just trying to avoid any mention of towns, roads or bridges, none of which are at Close Action!

I see your point about the Germans though. Ok, I'll change it again.



When I want your opinion - I'll tell you what it is!

 
Posted : 26/02/2010 10:42 am
Chomley-Warner
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LOL. I'm just thinking that from a players POV a scenario needs to be inspiring to take notice, part with the readies and travel half the length of the country. Paratroopers vs paratroopers is a nice concept which I don't think has been done so far (with option of Infantry for non-paras). And from our POV it needs to be both accurate as well as plausible (scenario fits site) and played in real-time. One day in the life of - not a week and 100 miles compressed into one day. So all we need is a hill location, no need for any other landmarks or places. :D

 
Posted : 26/02/2010 11:03 am
Sgt.Heide
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I agree completely. Para vs Para is a nice concept and we also have infantry vs infantry for good measure. I've edited the draft outline to reflect this.



When I want your opinion - I'll tell you what it is!

 
Posted : 26/02/2010 11:07 am
Old Un
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If i recall correctly no US airborne at Aachen as they were resting from Market Garden .

 
Posted : 28/02/2010 6:20 pm
Sgt.Heide
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Found this whilst trawling around. Some quite specific information on units and even individuals. Hopefully, something similar will surface about German troops (apart from 3rd Fallschirmjager Division).

-- attachment is not available --



When I want your opinion - I'll tell you what it is!

 
Posted : 01/03/2010 6:02 pm
Chomley-Warner
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http://onmilitarymatters.com/pages/89180.htm
SS Artillery were in the area as well as Ersatz Regiment

http://66.102.9.132/search?q=cache:9Mr2qFJwbwEJ:www.history.army.mil/books/wwii/Siegfried/Siegfried%2520Line/siegfried-ch08.htm+devils+hill+market+garden&cd=22&hl=en&ct=clnk&client=firefox-a

Mention of German 2 Parachute Corps and Nebelwurfers
[url]
http://books.google.com/books?id=gmy3ln ... q=&f=false[/url]
Mention of 325th action on 2nd October.
And map of area/hill
Fierce German actions on 1st & 2nd Oct

Oh, and some relics and photos of Devils Hill
http://warrelics.eu/forum/battlefield-archeology/battle-devils-hill-1756/

 
Posted : 04/03/2010 10:57 am
Chomley-Warner
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The commander of the U.S. 82nd Airborne Division was sceptical of the Market Garden plan. In his diary he wrote, "It looks very rough. If I get through this one I will be very lucky."

October 1944.

Operation Market Garden had not gone particularly well for 508th of the 82nd Airborne Division, despite landing within 1000 metres of their drop zones on the initial landings and preventing the destruction of a key bridge. Tasked with clearing, patrolling and defending the area of Dalkamp hill , they find themselves with the enemy on three sides and have fended off numerous determined German attacks, with more expected. If the Germans breakthrough, they could threaten the advance of British reinforcements by placing artillery observers on the high ground and bringing up their armour. To reinforce the beleaguered paratroops, 325th GIR are sent in to assist and force the Germans out. Landing amidst the enemy, they quickly find themselves embroiled in part of the battle which became known as "Devils Hill", which would drag on for several days.

Facing the "All Americans" was the legendary Field Marshall Model. Among those under his command are troops in transit or on leave in the Wesel area. These would be known as "Corps 'Feldt", a battle group of Heer and Elite Fallschirmjager, along with assorted Waffen SS troops. Many of these troops are battle hardened veterans, sent to Holland to recuperate, "old men and boys" they most certainly are not. These troops under the command of General Kurt Feldt, from which the Kampfgruppe drew its name, are to recapture Dalkamp from the US 82nd Airborne at all costs. Success could turn the tide of the war by giving the allies a bloody nose they may not recover from.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Our event takes us to one day in very early October 1944 where the 508th, occupying "Devils Hill", find themselves under fierce attack by 3rd Fallschirmjäger Division paratroopers, SS artillery and Ersatz Regiments. 325th GIR are now in the area of Den Heuval Woods in an attempt to assist but the might of the German army is determined to clear the area of Allied control.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This one day event will be held at Close Action Airsoft (10 miles from Corby) on Sunday 3rd October 2010.
The cost is £35 payable in advance. Camping and social available on Saturday night.

 
Posted : 04/03/2010 11:15 am
Chomley-Warner
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OK to start posting up in the events section?

I'm keen to get this there before Gadge starts posting since he is on his usual high post-event thinking the world is gagging for his next gig. :wink:

Open bookings beginning of June?

 
Posted : 04/03/2010 11:50 am
HeadShot
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Nice one! Pete and I have been talking and are going to speak about this in earnest on Sunday and we'll get going on more of an event plan.

I really don't want to open booking until Jedburgh's out of the way really though.



 
Posted : 04/03/2010 11:52 am
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