Camo... do we over do it?

Peadot was withdrawn in the winter of 1944 due to the losses coursed by Peadot not being very good in SNOW.

I'm sure i've read it was more to the fact it fell to bits too easily well before any snow fell. The wear on the kit was unsustainable not combat losses.

Interested to see the stuff about it being withdrawn regards snow though.

Christ, it's Orky!!!!

Hahha

In seriousness that a Canadian soldier, publication of that pic really annoyed the war office as it showed commonwealth troops unshaven whereas they wanted to portray the men in public as pristine!

Some interesting details.

- Tattoo on right left arm
- trouser braces worn over KD shirt.
- buttons from denims on KD shirt.
- dark coloured (blancoed maybe?) webbing
- metal trouser braces buttons on the outside of the trousers

What Hubert said.

So do we have a camo fixation?

I don't now, having got rid of much of mine.

Is it uncool just to wear khaki or field grey?

Feldgrau rules!

Is it a disservice to history to portray the armies of the 40s decked out in cam like modern soldiers?

No. Whilst I have enormous respect for those who fought, IMO all we are doing is playing, so if we play with too much camo, we're just doing it badly.

I thought the "Operation Ariel" was an absolute blast and it was a non-camo event! If the theatre of war allows the use of camo, then I think it's fine.

I don't think we see to much of it anyway. The U.S players never wear it, which is great. The Brits only wear it for airborne themed events. Heer players have a nice mix, mainly zeltbahns and the occassional helmet cover. The Waffen SS guys have a great mix of camo in my opinion, some mix it with feldgrau as well, which looks great and avoids a too "uniform" look in the process.

At the end of the day, we're effectively holding private battles, not public events, so 100% accurate "reenactor" levels of kit aren't required. As long as it fits in with the period of the war we're fighting, if people want to spend the money on some gucci camo gear, let them get on with it.

I think it has got better, in the early days off this forum it seemed like everyone was going for german camo suits.
That and as much bling as could be fitted to the chest. It's all toned down now.
If the aim is to represent the norm, then SS should be wearing camo. Most got some.
Heer should be zelts and the odd helmet cover, depending on unit and period. GD got them, Lehr got them and in numbers.
US forces it is unusual, I have a pair of the camo pants I have worn once and only because I blew a seam on my mustards. Lucky they fitted the scenario.
Brits, as said above, you only seem to see it when it's correct for the unit.

I think it has got better, in the early days off this forum it seemed like everyone was going for german camo suits.
That and as much bling as could be fitted to the chest. It's all toned down now.

You may be confusing our day events with the evening lash ups of the Drink und Blingen Gruppe (sic). The deal with the D&BG is to imbibe as much alcohol as possible and managing to remain balanced and upright whilst wearing as much bling as possible.

Some interesting details.

- Tattoo on right left arm

Nothing particularly unusual in that, my great grandad had 'lower arm tattoos' noted on his army demob paperwork, and that was after ww1.

Especially as that tattoo is obviously a memorial tattoo (cross with wreaths)

It was far more common than is usually given creedence.

I was wondering what it was of and I think I've got it. A cross with ivy round it?

I was wondering what it was of and I think I've got it. A cross with ivy round it?

It's either just ivy, or wreaths with a name/s in it. pretty classic old-school design, up there with swallows and anchors.

I can't say I've been particularly bothered by over-use of camo gear, or even noticed that much. If it matters to the scenario at all then organisers of events will have stipulated whether camo is to be worn or not anyway.

In direct answer to the questions:
So do we have a camo fixation?
Yes of course, its cool kit. And chaps do like the idea that they can't be seen - its true of course, heh we have covered cam & concealment at all training days, you can almost step on someone with a denison or planetree. Great if you are doing an ambush but the reality is most of the time you are moving so the 'invisibly cloak' is more of a self-delusion! Lord, I've lost people wearing field grey/brown/olive and they are only 12' away.
Is it uncool just to wear khaki or field grey?
No, all kit is cool. It puzzles me why public reenactment battles seem to have most German troops in camo gear of one sort or another yet the public instantly recognise a German as wearing grey!
Is it a disservice to history to portray the armies of the 40s decked out in cam like modern soldiers?
No, as pointed out, a lot of camo isn't necessarily incorrect. Especially when you think airsoft events portray a few squads not battalions.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is that we often use camo smocks to conceal incorrect badging underneath. Indeed Gadge has advocated such an idea to add flexibility of attire without the ball ache of stripping and resewing. One of the problems of what we do is that we cover all campaigns over six years of conflict. Pukka kit for everyone would be impossible.

over use of camo?

Waffen ss - Type 1 Smock and helmet cover (ala Das Reich group regs), worn with feldgrau trousers or 1 set of peadots. Worn the peadots once at a PBI event.

Luftwaffe Fallschirmjager - green type-2 step in bonesack or splinter b Type-3, think I've worn that one only once maybe twice. I also own a green M38 cover and a splinter-b cover. Worn a each couple of times maybe, normally wear a sidecap.

Oh one denison smock, borrowed from Chomley - for TEHL

I have worn zeltbahns if the weather deemed it appropriate, and I had them with me.

You may be confusing our day events with the evening lash ups of the Drink und Blingen Gruppe (sic).

No, I dont think so. A noble cause but not to be confused with the early days.
Dont make me go back into the kit threads and pull the pictures. [mostly cause this connection is rubbish and each post or page change takes 10 minutes].
Still, it might serve to show just how much the forums kit standards have come on a couple of years.
Not because of pressure, there is little snobbery here but because there is an individual desire to get it right. References are being checked where once there was an aire of 'this is how I see a german soldier'. It was more 'filmsim' than 'milsim'. Each has it's place but the desire amongst the forum seems to be to get it as good and as correct as they can. Buy once, buy right.
Look at how, with a little time and lots of effort certain sections are blending in with and often putting to shame re-enactors. You could not have done that when I joined. Not that that should be a goal for every airsofter, take detailing as far as you want, keep your fun and funds in the game.

Perhaps, but then again I don't like camo, where others find it cool I find it rather vulgar, but personal choice and all that. Fieldgrey, Khaki and Olive drab for me.

Perhaps part of the view would be that we 'over-represent' the 'elite' units, which we associate with having these camo items.

Why is it that... when German camo gets brought up, more so Waffen SS camo.There all ways seems to be the word "cool" in there some were.Not the fact that they were issued it and thats why its worn..If i wanted to just look "cool" i would have took up 1970's Disco in stead

If i wanted to just look "cool" i would have took up 1970's Disco in stead

Now thats a mental image you just dont want. Mr B strutting his stuff under the disco ball a la John Travolta

I think Wladek has a very good point, over-emphasis on 'elite' troops means, for the Germans at least, a higher saturation of camo kit. However, all is not lost - I think we are now seeing an up-swell of regular infantry in both US and German. May be in time the denison will also be sidelined somewhat?

Already is with PBI... the current push is to get at least a section of us in Hallamshire BD by march.

Initially the denison was the 'cheap choice' for starting brits as you didnt need to buy a BD jacket + insignia (cheap repros did not exist and paradoxically spending between £60 [replicators] and £100 [rangercamp] was cheaper than a BD with badges)... equally maroon berets are a couple of quid whereas GS caps cost about £30 for a repro. obviously I'm dismissing doing counts as there with Belgian and Greek kit etc.

Until recently its been tricky to do brit line inf without breaking the bank unless you spent a lot of time and skill converting 49 pat.

...the very fact that my Brit line infantry kit ISNT in a camo is what appeals.

Ditto!