Hi all
I have decided to start putting together an Ernst Barkman loadout as a drinking uniform with plenty of bling (and also as a spare uniform for my son to borrow).
I intend to do the uniform at the time of end of the Normandy campaign when he had recieved the Knights Cross and promotion to Oberschafuhrer.
I have researched his uniform and the awards he would have had(wore) at this time but have a couple of queries regarding his rank badges.
The photo below will help to show what I am trying to portray.
I believe the Oberschafuhrer rank was represented by 1 pip on the shoulder boards and 2 pips on the collar tab.
My Queries are as follows:
1) In the picture above the collar tab pip is what appears to be the nuymber '2'. Can anyone confirm this or is this just my old eyes playing tricks on me? If so is this a reference to his division 2nd SS Panzer Das Reich?
2) I presume you have to purchase the pips seperately and add them to both the collar tab and shoulder boards?
3) were the same size pips used on both?
Thanks in advance for your help.
Tim
Hi Tim, this is a long way from my area of expertise, but hopefully I can clarify some points:
1. Erm... don't know! 
Heh, however, I think it unlikely to be a number 2. If it is Das Reich, then it is most likely the Division's symbol - 
2. Yes.
3. Erm... don't know! Epic Militaria do various sizes of pips: http://www.epicmilitaria.co.uk/section. ... ccessories
So... only slightly more useful than a chocolate fireguard, sorry!
You've got nothing to ein, zwei, drei, vier
1. Erm... don't know!
Hi Steiner, yes I suppose it could be. However I have found another photo below which I think does look more like a '2'.
3. Erm... don't know! Epic Militaria do various sizes of pips: http://www.epicmilitaria.co.uk/section. ... ccessories
Ah yes thanks for the link, I thought I had seen them somewhere 
In the new photo they both look the same size so I guess it will be trial and error to find what size looks most authentic. If it is a 2 I guess I could fashion them from tresse? 
....waits for Poacher....
Two 'n's on Barkmann please 
Well done for starting your research before splashing out on bling. L33t units were allowed all sorts of non-standard shenanigans, so the cipher may well be a 2, however unless you want to search for original items (which can be a lot of fun) you'll be a bit restricted by what dealers have in their repro inventory.
Usually the collar tab stars are smaller than those on shoulder boards but this chap seems to have used the larger size. Another example of veterans not complying with re-enactor rules 
....waits for Poacher....
Two 'n's on Barkmann please
Apology 
L33t units ? Sorry dont understand the banter
Another example of veterans not complying with re-enactor rules
Yes that could explain both the pips and the '2'
Thanks
Bedsnherts, being really young, is using text speak - L33t = élite.
You've got nothing to ein, zwei, drei, vier
Numbers on shoulder boards are almost always regimental not divisional.
Research what regiment this chap was in?
At one point he was 2nd company, 2nd regiment, 2nd SS panzer division????
Company numbers were in Prussian times shown on the shoulder board button. This was done to a limited extent by old soldiers in WW2 but was not policy.
Regiment went on the boards and in the SS, Division on the cuff.
aka Stigroadie
AFRA
better by design
"Truth is a shining goddess, always veiled, always distant, never wholly approachable, but worthy of all the devotion of which the human spirit is capable. "
Bedsnherts, being really young, is using text speak - L33t = élite.
Ah thanks, really dont do texts
Numbers on shoulder boards are almost always regimental not divisional.
Research what regiment this chap was in?
This would make sense, at this time he was in the 2nd SS Panzer Regiment, 4th Company, 2nd Platoon.
Company numbers were in Prussian times shown on the shoulder board button. This was done to a limited extent by old soldiers in WW2 but was not policy.
Regiment went on the boards and in the SS, Division on the cuff.
As BedsnHerts said this is proberbly a case of L33t units (learning to get down with the'kids'!) doing their own customisation.
Cheers Poacher thats a big help
If it is a 2 I guess I could fashion them from tresse?
I'd avoid the use of tresse to make the '2'.
It would be either embroidered or a metal pin on device. Unless you can show the use of tresse for this stay away.
Numbers and other devices on shoulder boards were typically a pre-war, early war thing in the Heer. They went from direct application on the boards to slip on bands usually in the waffenfarbe applicable to the unit. NCO and officers used the metal numbers in silver or gold. You will find them in use later in the war especially by NCO. Panzer jaeger units kept the pink 'P' very late on and Lehr and GD kept their cipher.
Divisional devices were not uncommon on shoulder boards in the SS. LAH seemed to keep theirs through to the wars end.
As BedsnHerts said this is proberbly a case of L33t units doing their own customisation.
It's actually him conforming to standard practice? 2nd regiment and showing a '2' on his boards, spot on, by the book, if a little late war.
These photos are clearly of him in his best uniform. Little details like large size stars on the collar tab, the late war use of regimental numbers and other quirks are not unusual on best dress.
aka Stigroadie
AFRA
better by design
"Truth is a shining goddess, always veiled, always distant, never wholly approachable, but worthy of all the devotion of which the human spirit is capable. "
Ok my search fu has failed to turn up a numeral 2 pin so far, so may well have to find someone local who does embroidery.
Thanks for the help
http://www.germanmilitaria.com/Heer/11C ... gnia4.html
http://www.germanmilitaria.com/WaffenSS ... etal6.html
These links might help with the style for the embroidery?
Numbers were often a chain stitch.
aka Stigroadie
AFRA
better by design
"Truth is a shining goddess, always veiled, always distant, never wholly approachable, but worthy of all the devotion of which the human spirit is capable. "
http://www.germanmilitaria.com/Heer/11ClothInsignia4.html
http://www.germanmilitaria.com/WaffenSS ... etal6.html
These links might help with the style for the embroidery?
Numbers were often a chain stitch.
Thanks Poacher, yes that will be a great help to show the style. Great website pity its all soooh expensive
Awards and decorations
At the time of his capture in 1945, Barkmann was authorized the following awards:
•Wound Badge in Gold
•Infantry Assault Badge in Silver
•Panzer Badge "25"
•Iron Cross 2nd Class
•Iron Cross 1st Class
•Knight's Cross of the Iron Cross
As a commander in 4./I./2.SS-Panzer-Regiment Das Reich, Barkmann was responsible for the destruction of many enemy tanks.
So, I guess that's were the '2' is coming from on his should tabs.
Source: http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Ernst_Barkmann
•Wound Badge in Gold •Panzer Badge "25"
Interestingly I have not seen a single picture of him wearing the Panzer Badge "25".
I am guessing that the Wound badge would be silver at the time of Normandy, as he was also injured later in the war.
There are various examples of 2's on the earlier link - http://www.germanmilitaria.com/Heer/11C ... gnia4.html .
If you go with a metal version, why not use current/obsolete Police epaulette numerals - cheap and easy to get hold of (eg http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/OBSOLETE-NOT- ... _500wt_715 - NC to seller), look very similar to the various styles of pre-war & WW2 numerals listed and, if they are not quite right, they could always be filled down a little, and/or painted gold if required .................... ?
Hope that helps (or HTH for the younger members 
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There are various examples of 2's on the earlier link - http://www.germanmilitaria.com/Heer/11C ... gnia4.html .
If you go with a metal version, why not use current/obsolete Police epaulette numerals - cheap and easy to get hold of (eg http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/OBSOLETE-NOT- ... _500wt_715 - NC to seller), look very similar to the various styles of pre-war & WW2 numerals listed and, if they are not quite right, they could always be filled down a little, and/or painted gold if required .................... ?
Most excellant 
Yes I think these could be suitably modified, your search fu is stronger than mine
Hope that helps (or HTH for the younger members
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