Following a nasty incident with a BB involving a K98 recently one of my regs went of and did some research, and I got this Pm from him today :
"After the incident with the guys nose at the WWII Event Myself, Steve and a friend did some testing up at gunman last week with the Tanaka K98, it was the 98 so it may not be relevant to your version but as your the marshall its likely worth you knowing anyway.
We found that with 134a Gas the average FPS of the rifle was 440-460 which is fine and tallies with what the guy at Worthing said he was getting from the gas he used.
But we found that the first BB out of a mag that had been allowed to warm up over the course of the day (filled in the morning then just left in webbing all day) would come out at 989 FPS with a 0.28 BB.
We couldnt get the chrono to read a 0.2 as it was only 3 digits and so 1000+ was an Error.
This happened on the first BB of all 10 magazines we had avaliable, following shots were down in the sub 500 range.
We imagine that this first BB is what hit that poor bloke in the nose
Im no gas expert so I wont speculate as to how or why this happens but just something you might want to be aware of."
Interesting enough I thought to post this info on here, and see if anyone has had similar experiences.
989fps???!!!! I find that very hard to believe! Even fully upgraded with a BGS hop, tight barrel, Hidyaka 200% hammer springs and hi flow valves, you'd struggle to get over 800fps on propane, even on a hot day. A 900fps plus shot would have done a LOT more damage than happened to your unfortunate player.
The highest I've ever seen a Tanaka K98 go is about 780fps, when the temperature was 30 Celcius and the gun was running propane. Obviously, it wasn't used in any games!
When I want your opinion - I'll tell you what it is!
One thing to think about is that on my chrono, when the mag is full, it chucks out a lot of liquid/gas on the first firing, which messes up the chrono reading when trying to measure it.
My crappy chinese Winchester was allegedly putting out over 600fps, when in actuality, it was putting out about 350-400fps regardless of whether it was that first shot or the rest of the mag.
As a matter of interest I'll find out which chrono they were using.
Obviously I would be very interested to hear the results of these trials.
The BB that hit Grant had been heated up somehow. When they took it out it had cauterized the wound according to the nursing staff 
I know that in reenactment the police have pressed charges on people after an injury (Twinwoods) even if neither party had.
The Tanaka question certainly needs looking at just to cover every one.
Well investigated Jimbo.
I know that in reenactment the police have pressed charges on people after an injury (Twinwoods) even if neither party had.
According to the Independent [link]http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/martial-arts-expert-badly-injured-in-reenactment-of-medieval-battle-496831.html[/link]
"Detective Sergeant John Walters said it was not a criminal investigation".
That said, it is still an important safety issue to ensure that fps and MED limits are adhered to.
Oh good news on that. I'd heard many variations on it. Thanks Martin 
It happened about 8' behind me and must admit made my skin crawl afterwards 
EDIT
Just read the article, things have moved on since that report 
And as for one of the countries best swordsmen 
It did cause a lot of difficulties for everyone. Good news he is still on the mend.
I think DM raises a valid point, It is entirely feasable that the chrono is actually measuring the velocity of the gas which has escaped around and in front of the BB rather than the BB itself. I know i have had problems trying to chrono gas shottys and pistols in the past due to the gas confusing the chrono.
It would probably be a much better idea to do some actual penetration testing using ballistic putty or similar (plasticine) to see if the first BB out the mag really is any more powerful then the rest. I too find 1000+fps very hard to believe. 
“I wanted to come to the Volga at a specific location at a specific city. By chance it carries the name of Stalin himself. So don’t think I marched there for this reason – it could carry another name – but because there is a very important goal... this goal I wanted to take – and you know – we are very modest, we have it already."
Adolf Hitler, November 1942
"Comrades, Red Army men, commanders and political workers, men and women guerrillas! It is on your perseverance, staunchness, fighting skill and readiness to discharge your duty to the country that the defeat of the German-fascist army and the liberation of the Soviet land from the Hitlerite invaders depend! We can and must clear the Soviet land of Hitlerite vermin."
Joseph Stalin, November 1942
Oooooooh! I'd forgotten how fit Kari Byron looks as a redhead! 
When I want your opinion - I'll tell you what it is!
But we found that the first BB out of a mag that had been allowed to warm up over the course of the day (filled in the morning then just left in webbing all day) would come out at 989 FPS with a 0.28 BB.
We couldnt get the chrono to read a 0.2 as it was only 3 digits and so 1000+ was an Error.
I've built a *lot* of gas airsoft guns over the years. The most i've ever got was just over slightly over 900 FPS (from a shooter running conventional gas - not regulated CO2) It was on a seriously modified Tanaka M700. It was fitted with a powerbolt, custom mainspring, and running red gas on a day where the ambient temp was over 30C. I'll point out right now that it was built a tech demonstrator, not for use skirmishing!
Out of interest, what chrono was being used?
Maths time:
989 FPS with a 0.2g BB would equal roughly 1170 FPS with a 0.2g BB. Speed of sound is 1125FPS, so you would have had a very audible crack from the muzzle, cos the BB would be supersonic at that velocity...
**edited with disclaimer for use of the aforementioned M700**
When we were a Kingdom it was run by a King
When we were an Empire it was run by an Empress
Now we're a country we're run by a..........
im pretty sure we have done this whole evil k98 topic already .and as for 1000fps or whatever 
theres nowt so Permanent as temporary
im pretty sure we have done this whole evil k98 topic already .
To death, in fact.
When I want your opinion - I'll tell you what it is!
to put a final quote on this topic - Uncle Albert says - "During the War, we didn't have Tanaka K98k rifles!"
However, they have been around for some time now included and tested by the CiA organisers - who were happy with the tests.
i think we've all heard the 78's 33's, tape, DAT, CD, MP3 and what ever future incarnation of audio format that will come out relating to airsoft weapons, MED's and what not.
How about a nice cup of tea and the odd game or two?
Frankly, following Kermit's post, I'm a bit disappointed I haven't heard a sonic boom from a Tanaka yet
Maybe a 0.12 could oblige.
http://s1006.photobucket.com/albums/af1 ... AME581.jpg
I'm not K98 bashing or taking the P, but when a visiting player goes home with a BB embedded in his nose, I thought it worth enquiring about. I'm not blaming the shooter either, if it was anyone's fault, it was mine for not checking the weapon prior to the event. All I was trying to establish is, ...is there the possibility that a first bb out of a warm mag can do this throught the slot of a full face mask!
Mods if your'e fed up with Tanaka k98 safety questions, please delete the thread.
I think the suggestion of 'first bb out' is very contentious and has hitherto been unnoticed - which is very odd wouldn't you think?
Dodgy chronoing due to gas as has been suggested and seems plausible.
As for 'a cauterising bb' - well, that defies any rational explanation.
I'd suggest proper research results are needed before causing alarm, something scientific and repeatable - plainly something is wrong, somewhere!
Incidentally, BBs embedded in soft tissue isn't that unusual - cheeks, forehead and now nose! Dammit, someone (I can't remember who 
still has one in their hand!).
Perhaps the moral is using paintball masks that have apertures small enough for a BB to penetrate (or are not airsoft specific) do NOT provide full face protection.
As for 'a cauterising bb' - well, that defies any rational explanation.
Hmm. I'd have thought a BB hot enough to cauterise skin would be too hot to maintain its structural integrity when it hit something.
maybe he just has a soft nose 
theres nowt so Permanent as temporary
