Div Patches

Any help?
http://www.petergh.f2s.com/flashes.html

Yes, huge help. Thanks.

OK I still don't understand about Arm of Service stripes. What were these supposed to tell people?

The colour tells you your arm of service...

red for infantry
dark blue/red for royal artillery
etc...

The number of them tells you the seniority of the brigade within the division
1 = most senior
2 = second most senior
etc...

As I am sure Yith meant to imply only brigaded infantry in a division wore the multiple strips

as an example on my KSLI BD I wear three red strips as they were part of 185 Brigade the junior (3rd) brigade of 3rd Infantry Divison.

There were/are many more colours of strip available for all the arms and services the colours maninly being the same ones you would see on their vehicle unit identification plates.

As for Arms of service Stripes, don't buy the bordered ones from SoF for you Battledress. They're only really for Dress Uniform and Walking Out BD. The usual ones found on "In-the-feild" BD were just strips of felt (red, in this case for infantry). So for a more realistic look just go down to your local sewing/fabric show and buy some tight weave red felt and cut a 2" by 1/4" or 2" by 6/16" strip from it. I've made a few and can send you some spare fabric in an envelope if you like, or some pre-cut ones if you don't want to cut your own.

From the same website I directed you to last time:
http://www.petergh.f2s.com/armstrips.html

Thanks McV. I've been trying to get my head around the description contained in your link and am still utterly baffled. What I am trying to work out is what the shoulder patches should be for a 2nd Btn Bedfs & Herts officer (10th brigade, 4th Division).

So far I've worked out...:

Bedford & Hertford rocker
4th Infantry Div Patch (the quartered circle ones which seem to not exist as repros anywhere).
Scarlet line infantry stripe

and then ???

ref: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_4t ... y_Division

It looks like they were in the 10th Brigade, which is senior brigade in the division, so what you list is all you need.

http://www.montyslocker.co.uk does the div insignia. In fact he does two types, so you'll need to email him to work out which you need. He'll do all the rest of the stuff as well. He's a good bloke and I know him quite well now as I don't buy my embroidered insignia anywhere else... Tell him I sent you...

That's fantastic. Thanks for that.

Last question of the day - were the same patches used for Dress Uniform?

It varies from regiment to regiment, battalion to battalion and from theatre to theatre

The only chance you have is to find a photograph of the uniform being worn. Imperial War Museum archives is one place to start... Regimental Museum is another.

Cheers Yith. Just spoke to Derek from Monty's Locker. What a top guy. Turns out his dad was in the B&H as well so he had a shedload of useful info for me. Says you owe him money btw (kidding).

heh... yeah he is a good bloke...

If anything, he owes me stuff right now...

Just bought the Osprey book on British Battle Insignia and am more confused than before. It seems that every division, battalion, company and sometimes individual soldier just made their own interpretation of correct wear.

Yes, it's all very in-the-air as to how insignia was work in the field. What we've described/you've worked out is for what theoretically be the standard set-up of insignia. But, for instance, if you look closely at the picture on the left in my signature banner below, none of the chaps there have any insignia on their BDs, except for two of then who are sporting only the 3rd Div 'triangle' patch. No titles, no arms of service and mostly no div insignia. At the height of battle, no one cared about badges in the field.

1943 'invasion regs' state that BD should be complelty devoid of insignia other than rank .

How well this order was carried out varies from section to corps and feasibly *any* mix of insignia is theoretically ok.

Nothing to do with div patches but the following says something about soldiers and insignia.

Following on from Gadge's point, before ops glider pilots were issued with a set of anti-gas chemical impregnated BD to wear..... needless to say this was devoid of insignia but in the hours before departure they went to the trouble of sewing on at least their rank insignia and pilots wings. Ironically, they had orders to delete any reference in pay books as to their pilot status, which was scribbled through, despite that since D-Day these same paybooks had been affixed with a label signed "Commander Glider Pilots" which instructed that once their orders were fulfilled they were to immediately return to the UK for redeployment.

I think it says something about both soldier and army that despite orders to remove paper reference that they had been trained as pilots, the GPs still carried reference to being pilots and made sure they wore their wings!!